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The latest Katapult podcast features Katapult's Insights Director, Robbie Jones, and LDP's Senior Partner, Yael Coifman. They discuss the recent finding that 25% of Generation Z would consider living permanently in a theme park or resort.
But do people really want to live next door to rollercoasters, or is the data telling us something else?
Do people really want to live a theme parks?
Robbie Jones
One of the trends that we've picked up on the leisure and attractions industry report is this idea of living leisure. So, in five years time people will actually want to live at theme parks permanently and in fact the research we've done found that 25% will consider living permanently at a theme park or resort. Why do you think people are saying that they want to live at a theme park?
Yael Coifman
Yeah, I think that's a different thing than actually living in a theme park, to be honest. There are a couple of things that play into it. One of them is the sort of a post-COVID trend. There's an element of escapism that people want. They don't want to stay in their house all the time, etc cetera. But what you really see is with Generation Z and upcoming Generation Alpha.
Generations they really want to do experiences. They're much more about doing a creative experience with friends with family That can get their blood pumping on, you know be social etc They Say that they want to live in a theme park because that's one of the ways that they see it in terms of escapism and adrenaline and all that kind of stuff, but realistically
You you gotta look at the markets here. You gotta look at whether or not people can actually afford it. Because people have played with this idea in the past. I mean, I've definitely worked on projects where they were saying, let's put the hotel in the middle of the theme park and then people can be surrounded by it and get first access, et cetera. But logistically and operationally, that's a complete nightmare because the theme park can't run 24 hours. And realistically, how do people access their hotel room if the theme park is closed?
So that's why a lot of the times what you'll see now is you'll see themed hotels, but next to a theme park. Because you don't actually want to be locked in your room. So that's one of the things. logically doesn't make much sense. The other thing is also if you look at where people tried to make hotels into true theme park experiences, look at the Star Wars thing in Orlando. That's gone bust. Because at the end of the day, people couldn't pay and afford.
those high prices. And those high prices were partly driven by the fact that the staff requirements were so high. So it just logically doesn't really make that much sense at this juncture.
That being said, is one brand of attraction that's actually done a really good job of that, and that's zoos, where they actually have overnight accommodation and lodges where people are right up on top of the animals. know, mean, Zoo de la Fleche in France does it brilliantly. And you are basically locked in your room at night because the animals are outside and you're in the cage.
But that's what's so amazing. And this place actually, you know, they book out two years in advance. They're at 95% occupancy. So it can work. It's just in that case, the actors are animals that live there all the time versus the actors are people that need to get paid. but yeah, I think a big part of it is people just want to, you know, escapism, they want to play, et cetera.
Robbie Jones (03:46)
So I was going to ask, Clearly this demand for more leisure, I think we've seen that broadly across the industry, know, people wanting to do things, not just in vacation time, but throughout the week as well. How have you seen places like city centres and shopping centres develop over the last few years to accommodate that leisure demand?
Yael Coifman
One of the things we've seen a lot of is actually what we tend to call competitive socializing. And so that's a city centre experience, and it takes two to three hours, basically. That could be something like a Flight Club or Putt Shack or things where people can go have fun with their friends, good quality food and beverage in a somewhat themed environment, but it doesn't take a full day.
And I think that's the other thing we have to consider. People don't have the time to play all day, all the time. You they also have to work. So something where you can do like a two to three hour experience after work or on the weekends is actually much more accessible. And we've seen a lot of that. The other thing we've seen a lot more of is that sort of those gaming elements, not just competitive socializing, but things that you're living the game. So like Monopoly Live, for example, here in London.
where people are actually playing in a team, you know, with a super-sized Monopoly board. And again, it's a two to three hour experience. They're playing a game, but they're part of the game. And I think that's what is really appealing to people. They feel like they're part of the game. So instead of like going to see a film where you're passive, they're actively engaged in the experience. So that's definitely been very successful, especially here in London. And a lot more so in other shopping centres as well. People are adding them in.
Robbie Jones
I guess this is sort of the other aspect of the living leisure trend, which is people just want more things closer to them. And a temp in bowling alley and a six screen cinema isn't cutting it anymore, is it?
Yael Coifman
It's not cutting it anymore. think that's the big thing is that, you know, it is about accessibility. Um, and you know, you're not going to drive two hours to do something which takes two hours and then drive back another two hours. You really want something that'll take you, you know, 15 minutes, a half an hour to get to have fun for two or three hours. And then you can go home again. Um, it, as you said, a basic 10 minute bowling alley and cinema, that's just not good enough.
People have to be a lot more creative in terms of how to draw people in. I mean, as I said, I mentioned the competitive socializing already, but there's other things like some of those immersive experiences that are happening. Immersive dining experiences are a big one as well, where people are actually, you know, they're eating, but at the same time, they're engaged in the story. So it's a fun night out. It's got a little bit of a premium on it, clearly. It's not your typical restaurant but you're actively engaged. And I think that's what people are really looking for. They're looking for that active engagement. Another thing that we've actually seen really pop up recently is brand centres in city centres. So traditionally brand centres would be wherever the distillery is, for example, or whatever the chocolate factory is. And now you're seeing these brand centres that are going into city centres.
So people don't have to go out to the middle of nowhere to try the whiskey. There's a big chocolate experience in Switzerland, again, not at the factory, but in a city centre location. So that's a way for the corporates, for the brands to actually reach their customers in a fun and engaging way and those are really becoming more and more successful and definitely on trend.
Robbie Jones
And what do you think the industry is going to respond with to meet this demand for more living leisure, whether that's within the theme park setting or within the city centre location?
Yael Coifman
I think it's, I think it's twofold to be honest. think going back after the theme park, there is the element of adding more immersive, adjacent hotels that are themed with whatever the element is. perhaps giving them, you know, priority access in the morning before the gates become open to the public. It is important to remember that theming doesn't just mean, you know, smacking a logo on things. It actually is.
Creating an experience that you feel like you're part of a the brand or whatever IPs they have available So that that's nothing park side, I think The as I said, there's a conflict with having them in the theme park but adjacent to the theme park and priority access is one thing But in terms of the city centres, I think one of the things we're gonna see a lot more of is a lot more sort of specialty IP experiences that are coming into downtown locations. And one thing we're really going to see of is more integration of gaming. And not gambling, just to be clear, but like online gaming and stuff like that. I mean, you have the new Minecraft experience that Merlin is developing.
There are other IPs and brands that are, I mean, we've seen the success of the Nintendo World for Universal already, but you can do smaller things. And one of the reasons why I think there's a lot more potential with the gaming oriented attractions is because they're less staff intensive. Because again, it comes down to is this going to make money? And we have to remember that if you're located in a city centre or in a shopping mall, these are at the end of the day, you're a landlord. I'm sorry, you're a tenant and there's a landlord that has to pay his mortgage or payback his shareholders, etc. So it's definitely, you know, from the gaming side, you can rely much more on technology.
And you don't need as many live actors there to be part of the experience. Again, if you contrast the Paddington Bear experience, there are a lot of actors there to give you that experience. So it's almost easier to go with something that's completely artificial than to go with an IP that has humans involved in it. With the ongoing increase in the use of AI and all that kind of stuff, augmented reality, it could happen soon.
In addition to having gaming oriented attractions, the good thing about that is you can actually, we've always talked about gamification, but nobody's really doing it well. And so it's either a game in the location based entertainment element or it's gaming at home. By using online gaming, you can actually link the two experiences together. And so keep your customers engaged while they're at home playing their game and then they go into the the location based experience. They can be joined jointly connected in that way and I think that's an area that really has opportunities. And you can also as I said you know that could easily become an overnight experience. I tend to like to call them accommodation experiences not hotels because the staying in the accommodation needs to be an experience it's not just you know a room with some theming on the walls.
I think one of the things I would say is that, you know, when we're talking about adding accommodation experiences to theme parks, you have to make sure, I mean, that you're really, trying to create that destination, overnight destination, and you need to make sure there's enough people to do two days. Otherwise, you can't justify the overnight stay.
So that's one thing. I think the other thing was also, I mean, we do have an increase in, sorry, an increase in destination water park resorts. So it's not just water parks. You're actually adding surfing lagoons and active things such as canyoneering, et cetera. And so those, again, multiple things to do can drive the visitors there if you're in a tourist destination. On the live, work, play side of things, in addition to sort of like the pure entertainment that we were talking about, know, the immersive experiences, attractions, et cetera, there's also definitely room for more active play, both for kids and adults. So it's like soft adventure sports, indoors, where people can go and feel good about themselves for being healthy. And, you know, doing something that's a little bit more physical, a little bit more challenging.
And if that's pulled together with the sort of like competition element, that could work really well. Plus, when you're talking about entertainment for smaller children, one of the things that parents run into all the time is that their kids are glued to the screen. So how do you get them out? How do you get them exercise in a fun way? And I think those are areas we've seen that developed a little bit more and hopefully will grow a lot more in those areas.
Robbie Jones
Actually that's a really good point because one of the things we looked at last year as part of the last year's trends report was this idea that actually the response over the past three or four years from the industry is to create retreats, create destinations, the Therme Group really pushing ahead with sort of these regional health destinations. I can't think of a better word, but clearly it's not about creating thrilling destinations or that it's not about excitement when it comes to leisure. It can be calming, relaxing, restful, wellness generating.
Yael Coifman
Absolutely. And that's what I was talking about with the water parks is that they're adding a lot more things that could either be more active or more wellness based as well with spa facilities and retreats and yoga classes, et cetera. But again, we have to remember that for those things, you're taking two or three days out of your time and people can't always do that. So that's why I was suggesting that, you know, smaller urban activities, know, active play centres, we call them, for both adults and children. There's a lot, there's a lot of opportunity there. Because you have, you know, your urban day spas, but that's not the same thing. But if you did something where, you know, you'd have a blend of climbing wall and skydiving and parkour and trampolines for grownups, then they're having fun. And there's, you know, they're playing like a kid, but they're still still an adult and they can feel good because they've exercised. So that's, yeah, just something to consider there.
Robbie Jones
Cruises. So there has been significant investment by the industry again over the past two years lots of announcements around new builds of ships and cruise liners I guess this is another side of living leisure Have you seen the increase in both demands but also supply generated by the industry?
Yael Coifman
We've definitely seen some crazy. Yeah, think it's cruisers are an interesting one because you're essentially you have two markets that are developing. You still have for lack of better way to put it, and I hope I don't offend anyone out there, the older lazy cruiser who's really just going to, you know, relax for a week, you know, see some sides, do it in a safe environment and sit by the pool.
What the cruise industry is trying to do now is develop more of a younger, basically the next generation of cruisers. And one way they're doing that is through differentiating their cruise lines and their experiences with a lot more of the, know, either special events or themed cruises and stuff like that, or a lot more activities and entertainment elements on the cruise itself. How successful that's going to be? It's a recent thing. So let's see if they get the payback on their money.
In one sense, it reminds me a little bit of Las Vegas back in the 90s, where they tried to become a family destination. You had all these attractions added and roller coasters and things like that. And it really never took off that well because at the end of the day, it's a gambling town. And families didn't want to go there with their kids and have them be exposed to the casino on a regular basis. So the question is, can the cruise ship trend transition really and start appealing to those next generation of experienced addicts with all these additions and is it going to financially prove itself viable?
